Proffitt, et.al Cartway Hearing, September 13, 2008
MINUTES- NEW DOSEY TOWNSHIP- PROFFIT, et.al CARTWAY HEARING
SEPTEMBER 13, 2008
Meeting called to order at 10 a.m. by chair Dave Fornengo. Also present were supervisors Don Mishler and Dave Baker, clerk Fran Levings, Greg Beck, Pine County Forester, Todd Pottsmith, Lance Wells, Jason Proffit, Tom Henderson, Jack Henderson, Jonathan Pottsmith, Donald Proffit, Cevin Chapman, Scott Olson, Tim Henderson, Al Thorp, Bob Schueller, Bruce Schueller, Dick Olson, and Burt Schueller.
Motion by Dave Fornengo, second by Don Mishler, to accept the posted bond in the amount of $5100.00. Carried.
Supervisor Dave Baker- 3 pieces of correspondence regarding the proposed cartway.
1. Letter from Robin Poppe, Pine County Soil & Water Conservation District, stated that a proposed cartway on the SW ¼ of Section 2, would impact type 2,3,4 and 6 wetlands and permits would be necessary. (Full copy of letter is in township files.)
2. Letter from Greg Bennett, Pine County Land Department, recommended that the township reaffirm the existing road orders and open this route, declaring it a “Minimum Maintenance Road”. (Full copy of letter is in township files.)
3. Letter from Army Corps of Engineers stated that based on information from Ben Cox , who had walked the proposed route, this route would be require multiple analyses in evaluating the proposal’s impacts and they suggest that perhaps less damaging alternatives exist. (Full copy of letter is in township files).
Supervisor Baker then affirmed the validity of the cartway petition itself. He said that state law mandates that a cartway be provided by the township for landlocked property owners. At this time, the Kirchberg Road is neither a road nor a cartway nor an easement. The Kirchberg Road does not reach Proffit land, thus Mr. Proffit does NOT have access via the Kirchberg Road. Aggrieved parties will be paid damages for property taken. Petitioners will be responsible for building the cartway and all adjacent landowners will be the road authority and are responsible for maintenance of the cartway. The cartway would be open to the public.
Regarding the recommendation from the Pine County Land Commissioner to re-open the road that Judge Rueter ruled was not a town road, Supervisor Baker stated that because of the Marketable Title Act with it’s 40-year rule of non-maintenance by the township, this would require a lengthy hearing process, wetland mitigation concerns, and a huge expense.
Chair Fornengo then opened the hearing to concerns, questions and suggestions.
Greg Beck, Pine County Forester, said the county also had landlocked property in this area and would like to access it. He said funds are available to help provide a PUBLIC cartway, but not for a PRIVATE cartway. He asked the question as to whether or not Roger Larson has fixed a road to this area or not.
Supervisor Baker said that Judge Rueter’s ruling also stated that the “diagonal” across Mr. Henderson’s property was not an access. He said that board was aware that wetlands would have to be considered wherever the cartway is placed in Kingsdale, that mitigation would have to take place, bridges may be necessary, and the board would make this decision in as reasonable and sensible way as it feels possible.
In answer to a question from Dick Olson as to what other routes may be considered, Supervisor Baker said the Kirchberg Road could be extended and Adolph’s Drive could be extended about ½ mile across Hay Creek to reach Proffit land.
Lance Wells asked if there was an existing bridge or foundation. A chorus of “No” replied.
Greg Beck said that the Adolph’s Drive route would be expensive.
Jack Henderson stated that because there is no bottom on the bog on the other side of Hay Creek, wetlands would be impacted by the proposed route.
Dick Olson told the group that his father, back in the 1960s, has chosen this trail because it was NOT full of wetlands.
Don Proffit asked if the Kirchberg Road could legally be closed 6 months out of the year.
Scott Olson said the Kirchberg is not a public road.
Tim Henderson quoted the minutes of the August 4th minutes of the special town board meeting to discuss the status of the Kirchberg Road as saying that ½ to ¾ of the Kirchberg Road is on state or county land.
Scott Olson said that 4-wheelers can use the public part of the Kirchberg Road.
Greg Beck stated that Dale Kirchberg and Roger Larson gave public easements on part of the Kirchberg Road.
Tim Henderson said that he had an Army Corps of Engineers person, Ben Cox, walked the area of the proposed cartway and Mr. Cox pointed out several areas of wetlands. Mr. Cox will send a letter on his findings to the town clerk.
Clerk Levings asked Mr. Henderson where he would like the cartway to be located and he replied that they should use the road on the west side that has always been there. This is the Kirchberg Road.
Al Thorp supported this route saying it would only take ½ of new road and the proposed route would require 1 mile of road to be built.
Scott Olson referred to the former “gentleman’s agreement” that Sno-Camp persons and others had with Mr. Henderson and said he was disappointed with the end result. He also said that if the 3 petitioners- himself, Jerry Hanson, and Don Proffit, are willing to do the work and expense of the proposed route, they should be allowed to do so.
Discussion began to get rather tense. Supervisor Baker made a motion to recess the meeting so that the parties could walk the proposed and Adolph’s Drive routes. Second by Don Mishler, Carried. Consensus was to meet back at the hall to reconvene the meeting at 2 p.m. Recessed at 10:50 a.m.
(Recess)
Meeting reconvened at 2 p.m. by chair Fornengo.
Chair Fornengo outlined 3 options for the board to consider as a cartway for petitioners.
Clerk Levings suggested writing them each up with advantages and disadvantages provided by both the board and those persons present.
OPTION # 1 The route proposed by petitioners.
Advantages: 1. Closer to townsite of Kingsdale. All 3 petitioners own property in the Kingsdale townsite which they have, for years, used as a starting base for activities in property that is landlocked.
2. The footprint of the old and “presumed abandoned” road is visible.
Disadvantages: 1. Inconvenience to Tim Henderson. His land would be bisected.
2. Would require a lot of road work to be done by petitioners. Question asked here as to who has the liability of the cartway once it is opened? Clerk said she would ask Jay Squires, township attorney.
3. 6 wetlands to be considered. Army Corps of Engineers authorization would be required to commence any work that would result in discharge of dredge or fill materials in this area.
Neutral comment: Nine landowners would be affected .
OPTION # 2 Adolph’s Drive extended.
Advantages: 1. Shorter route via Kingsdale
2. Does not bisect Mr. Henderson’s land.
Disadvantages: 1. Inconvenience to landowner Burt Schueller. Mr. Schueller’s wife has emphysema and the gas emissions and dust of heavy travel would exacerbate her condition.
2. Very expensive- floodplain, 4 wetland areas, one or more bridges needed.
Neutral comment: Nine landowners affected.
OPTION # 3 The Kirchberg Road
Advantages: 1. Less expensive.
2. Less impact on wetlands.
3. ½ of this road is public already.
4. A New Dosey Land Association is being formed to make decisions regarding access to this road. The petitioners could withdraw the petition and join this Association.
Disadvantages: 1. Does not have year-round access.
2 12.5 miles from townsite of Kingsdale.
2. Making this road a cartway would be detrimental to the New Dosey Land Association in that they do not want it to be a PUBLIC cartway. They want to control and limit access.
3. Can the township make a road and/or cartway out of public land or even part of public land? Clerk Levings said she would ask Jay Squires about this.
4. If made public, the cartway will not hold up to public traffic.
5. Parking area is quite small.
Consensus of the board was to now research such issues as wetlands and expenses, then
bring all information and opinions to a continuance of this hearing. Clerk Levings will do the necessary research.
Motion by Dave Fornengo, second by Don Mishler, to continue this hearing on October 4, 2008, at 10 a.m. in the town hall.
This meeting on the hearing was adjourned at 3:10 p.m.
Respectfully submitted,
Fran Levings, Clerk
Also signed by the chair______________________________
Date signed______________________________